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Doug: Even in the current environment we're in right now with the economic crisis and in recent presidential candidate debates where mainstreet is mentioned as often as wallstreet -- is because it still a highly evocative term in the mind of the public and defines a physical place to be sure, a city center, even though there is no street with the actual name mainstreet -- it also evokes a populist image of a place that is accessible and belongs to everyone, so it really seems to serve as metaphor for how people come together and interact with no particular agenda and be part of something that's larger than their day to day personal life. For some it's maybe one of the most authentic experiences they can have in a real place. Those are powerful concepts and that's what's contributed to the appeal with the name of the program we have, Mainstreet. From our point of view we really think from a community development point of view, to be really a prosperous and sustainable community, you have to have a healthy core and we think the resources and assets most needed already exist in the community -- so our role is to build on the capacity of those local efforts and we do that by tapping successful ideas and experts on a national level and also to work to change policies for mainstreets all across the country.

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Doug: We have already seen a fairly steep increase in vacancy rates for shopping centers and strip malls across the country. This last week these vacancies hit an all time high since the early 90's. At the same time we're seeing an increase in the number of closures and consolidations of retail businesses on the national level, national level retailers. I think that in our experience of the last two economic cycles over the last few decades, the impact has been somewhat mitigated for small independent businesses in mainstreet districts and elsewhere -- and the reason I believe this is happening is that these businesses are far more diversified and resillient because they operate on a much smaller scale and profit margin and because of the way in which they operate and have invest in their community, they 're able to survive through some economic cycles that would be the death knell for a national retailer -- so it's not so much an opportunity as it is the potential for longevity for small businesses because they're far better situated to diversify their actions and operations fairly quickly to adapt to different market changes. For a small retailer in a mainstreet district, that could mean changing merchandise, hours, capital spending on a year to year basis. That helps. What hurts is that they have a limited market they're working in and in the past that has been problematic especially in different micro economic climates where in the Midwest or in the South there is a particular downturn in the economy. I think today the potential exists for all those retailers to utilize e-commerce as a way of broadening their markets. That will help them through those kinds of cycles.

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Doug: I mentioned that we track economic investment on a local level and there are very powerful numbers but they're really part of the story...the local programs are also a big pathway for leadership development for a lot of local citizens and I can't overemphasize because it's something so lacking in this day and age and that's an empowerment piece of the question you asked -- here's an example of one of our local programs -- it is in a small town called Elgin, Illinois and it is like most of our programs, non-profit, set up to manage their commercial district with support through municipal funding and memberships and fund raising -- and that supports the cost of hiring a full time manager to oversee the rehabilitation and promotions and business assistance. And like every other local program, that one paid staff person coordinates all local volunteers and there are hundreds of volunteers in each community and the volunteers are not always business owners in the district. In fact many have no financial interest in the town, they're just pitching in out of a sense of community pride, an important part of our program. What makes Elgin unique is in the shift in the population over the last few decades, which brought a significant Hispanic population into the city. These are people that might have felt like outsiders to the political and civic organizations that had been there and many newcomers had not been involved ever in a leadership position -- so like a lot of our changing communities this could have been a problem for Latin Americans in accessing jobs and becoming part of the city and to build wealth, so they really needed some kind of entryway in to the power structure of the community and the mainstreet program was a great tool for that. The first thing they did, the local manager involved several bock-by-block improvements downtown, everything from cleaning up to safety patrols -- that gave some newcomers their first taste of involvement. From there, some became involved in larger projects like festivals and that's what became a pathway to board positions and helped give direct access to elected officials, investors, local corporations and in fact right now the Elgin program has it first Hispanic board chair and as a result the Hispanic community feels it has a voice in local matters, a big change from where they were ten years ago. A lot of those skills needed for this, are acquired from the work and coaching from the local manager and our training through our workshops and events, on the local and national level and we're starting them online, to help develop leadership skills.

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Doug: I returned last week from a conference in Canada where there is a parallel mainstreet program in the province of Quebec, based on the U.S. mainstreet approach. They're very interested in some type of parternship with us and they're eager to get together with Europe. We have counterparts in the UK called the Association of Town Center Management and also similar programs in some European countries. Over last 15-20 years, we've had regular communication with other countries, exchanged presentations and materials, etc. All these programs share a common methodology with our approach so we think we can build an international coalition for this type of work. We've also worked in other countries directly. In addition to Canada and Australia, we've worked in some Asian locations, Japan and Singapore, Eastern European locations Poland and Ukraine and I think there's a lot of value in that. We don't have an actual accreditation on an international basis because our focus is mainly on national but most of what we offer in information and training and even affiliation is avialable to all. Our website is mainstreet.org It offers a good introduction to our work and resources with links to our public and membership. We've worked in 2000 communities here in the U.S. but many more are using our other resources...we're growing the use of internet and social media for a lot of this kind of information. One reason we don't work internationally is that we recognize there are certain unique cultural assumptions that our program is based on, such as the volunteer ethic, that is so strong in our mainstreet programs and even the tradition of philanthropy we know is different in the States than it might be elsewhere -- so we would need to work extensively with an international partner to make sure we fully understand those elements and how those elements work in another culture in order to ensure success. In our limited experience, we have seen just how different that is, where in other countries, there is an expectation for a centrally managed government operation that we described through our non-profit programs here in the States. That is true even in Canada, in Quebec.

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Doug: 25 years ago when we started, most everyone in the us had already given up on mainstreets and downtown in general. They were popularly seen as somewhat passe and even a relic and if we have been successful in our program, it's because we have challenged that notion that they are just kind of a piece of nostalgia and we've done that by proving it slowly over time one city at a time that this concept of mainstreet really does still matter, not because of any sense of nostalgia but because it's really a key tool for sustainability and development. As an urban planner by training, I am amazed at how much that profession has changed over the last two decades. When I emerged from school the idea of historical preservation was seen more as a fad and not integral to urban development -- but now historical preservation is universally seen as a tool for community and even economic development. If you think about the whole entire set of parallel movements, smart growth and sustainability movements -- they have really matured into very compatible philosophies with the mainstreet approach.

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