Transcript
The Inside Story: The Artemis Generation
Episode 87 – April13, 2023
Show Open:
Shanna DeLeon, Orion Program Office Software Manager:
This is the largest mission that NASA has taken on.
Unidentified Narrator:
Humans last stepped foot on the moon in 1972 during NASA’s Apollo program.
More than fifty years later, that’s about to change.
Branelle Rodriguez, NASA Orion Program Integration Manager:
Apollo had a sister, Artemis, and this is our generation, and I think this is a fantastic thing to really go explore and put a presence on the moon.
Unidentified Narrator:
The Artemis Generation, now, on the Inside Story.
The Inside Story:
KANE FARABAUGH, VOA Midwest Correspondent:
Thanks for joining us. I’m VOA’s Midwest Correspondent Kane Farabaugh here at Kennedy Space Center in Florida.
The launch and return of the unmanned Orion capsule as part of NASA’s Artemis 1 mission marks the beginning of a new chapter in space exploration. As hundreds of analysts and engineers around the world review the data coming in from the mission, planning is underway for the first crewed mission back to the lunar surface, in what NASA hopes becomes a long term presence on the moon.
Shanna DeLeon, Orion Program Office Software Manager:
This is the largest mission that NASA has taken on.
KANE FARABAUGH:
As it traveled farther than any craft designed to carry people, NASA’s staff watched intently as volumes of data streamed back from Artemis 1’s uncrewed Orion capsule.
Shanna DeLeon, Orion Program Office Software Manager:
Thermal analysis. Vibe acoustic.
Kirstyn Johnson, Orion Crew Survival Systems Project:
Analyzing the data from the Orion seat to understand the dynamic response to having the mannequin in there.
Branelle Rodriguez, Orion Program Integration Manager:
We want to make sure the spacecraft is set up for those challenges – radiation, things like that.
KANE FARABAUGH:
The Orion capsule’s 26 day journey, carrying 3 mannequins tens of thousands of kilometers beyond the moon, tested NASA’s ability to one day carry astronauts like Victor Glover in a craft where the crew won’t have much independent control.
Victor J. Glover, NASA Astronaut:
The maneuvers it's going to do are so complicated that for me to have manual control throughout the entire regime of flight actually adds risk that that we aren't necessarily trying to buy off on.
Shanna DeLeon, Orion Program Office Software Manager:
We will have Astronauts will be on board, they will monitor all their systems, they will have 60 plus displays that show everything on the vehicle and provide telemetry and command interface to the vehicle, but automation in the background will be operating the mission in its entirety.
KANE FARABAUGH:
NASA’s Shanna DeLeon, a veteran of the Space Shuttle program, is part of the team working on new and very different technology from that used by the last astronauts to reach the moon.
Shanna DeLeon, Orion Program Office Software Manager:
It’s very different than the Apollo era of capsule where you had switch throws and multiple astronauts, and you called the astronauts to make actions that would operate the vehicle. Artemis is automated - it’s a software driven vehicle, it’s a data driven vehicle that will automate everything from takeoff through splashdown.
KANE FARABAUGH:
NASA officials expressed confidence in Orion’s overall performance – despite some minor technical glitches. The agency must now sort through the collected data in preparation for the next step – Artemis 2.
Branelle Rodriguez, Orion Program Integration Manager:
All the data we get is a success. And that’s the important thing, to go off and test that out so we can buy down that risk for Artemis 2.
KANE FARABAUGH:
While Space X is also working on a new rocket system to reach the moon to assist in NASA’s long-term goals, Program Integration manager Rodriguez says the Orion capsule is NASA’s craft of choice for the foreseeable future.
Branelle Rodriguez, Orion Program Integration Manager:
This isn’t just this test flight – this is the start of a fantastic campaign that is going to extend our exploration.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Program manager David Reynolds says the entire future of spaceflight depends on this first uncrewed attempt to return to the moon.
David Reynolds, Deputy Program Manager, SLS Boosters:
As you tick off the different boxes, you buy down a certain amount of risk for the crewed flight. And so, once you have made that determination and we decide that it is safe enough to fly with crew, we will have considered it a mission success.
Bill Nelson, NASA Administrator:
It’s been more than a half century since astronauts journeyed to the moon. Well folks, that’s about to change.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Standing in Houston, Texas before the current astronaut corps and veterans of the Apollo and Space Shuttle programs, NASA Administrator Bill Nelson introduced the four-member crew of Artemis II – Christina Koch, Victor Glover, Reid Wiseman, and Canadian Jeremy Hansen.
Bill Nelson, NASA Administrator:
This is humanity’s crew.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Reid Wiseman is mission Commander for Artemis II, while Christina Koch and Jeremy Hansen will serve as mission specialists. Koch is set to make history as the first woman on a lunar mission and Hansen as the first international astronaut to take such a journey, something NASA Administrator Nelson emphasized during the announcement.
Bill Nelson, NASA Administrator:
We choose to go back to the moon and on to Mars, and we are going to do it together, because in the 21st century NASA explores the Cosmos with international partners.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Victor Glover, a U.S. naval aviator, will pilot the Orion spacecraft on the 10-day roundtrip mission around the moon, testing the functions of the systems and equipment that future crews will use to eventually return to the lunar surface.
In an interview with VOA before last year’s Artemis 1 mission, Glover said he embraces the historic opportunity to be the first person of color assigned to a moon mission.
Victor Glover, NASA Astronaut:
People keep asking me, is it meaningful to you that little Black kids look up to you and say they want to be like you? You know what? Let's be honest, I represent America. I'm a naval officer and I work for NASA. I represent America and little white kids, little Mexican kids, little Hispanic kids, and little Iranian kids follow what we're doing because this is maybe one of the most recognizable symbols in the universe.
KANE FARABAUGH:
The initiative to ensure diversity in NASA’s Artemis program was outlined in the Biden administration’s $25 billion funding request to Congress for NASA for fiscal year 2022, which includes the moon missions.
Agency managers, including Branelle Rodriguez, are embracing the mandate.
Branelle Rodriguez, NASA Orion Program Integration Manager:
Apollo had a sister, Artemis, and this is our generation, and I think this is a fantastic thing, people to go and really.
KANE FARABAUGH:
She is proud to participate in an historic project that will also bring the first woman to the moon.
Branelle Rodriguez, NASA Orion Program Integration Manager:
I think it’s important for all of us, whether it’s a man or a woman, I think it’s fantastic. I think as an agency, as a nation, and as a world, showing that we can explore as humans back to the surface of the moon is what we need to go off and show.
Danielle Bell, Northwestern University Assistant Professor:
To do this once, would feel like performing.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Danielle Bell teaches marketing and communications at Northwestern University. She focuses on issues of diversity and inclusion and welcomes NASA’s initiative, which she hopes is permanent.
Danielle Bell, Northwestern University Assistant Professor:
When they are transformative and not performative, that happens when the organization lives their values from the inside out.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Women make up one-third of the current group of 41 astronauts at NASA. Twelve are people of color. While 16 are experienced pilots, the rest are experts in fields such as geology, medicine and engineering, bringing professional diversity to the corps.
Danielle Bell, Northwestern University Assistant Professor:
What I can appreciate about this mission is that it’s not just about diversity, it’s not just about representation. You’ve got an entire pool that is of diverse backgrounds, right, so check that box.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Not only is the makeup historic, the crew of Artemis II could also venture farther in space than any humans before them, traveling over 1 million total kilometers in a path that extends well beyond the moon before returning back to Earth. NASA says the exact distance and plan depends on a number of factors, including the date of the actual mission launch.
Christina Koch, NASA Astronaut:
So, am I excited? Absolutely! But my real question is: are you excited?
KANE FARABAUGH:
At the end of the NASA ceremony introducing his crew, Reid Wiseman expressed the determination of the agency to further its goals in space despite repeated delays and cost overruns.
Reid Wiseman, NASA Astronaut:
There’s three words we keep saying in this Artemis program, and that’s “We. Are. Going.” And I want everyone to say it with me – “We Are Going!”
KANE FARABAUGH:
NASA Hopes to launch Artemis 2 as early as November 2024, with the first mission to the lunar surface as early as 2025.
The European Space Agency has selected seven of its astronauts that will train side by side with NASA astronauts in the Artemis missions returning to the moon. One of those ESA astronauts is Germany’s Alexander Gerst. In the leadup to the launch of Artemis 1, we talked with Gerst, a geophysicist and veteran of several missions to the international space station, about his hopes for Artemis.
How do you feel at this moment on the precipice of what's about to happen? How do you feel right now knowing that this is a possibility?
Alexander Gerst, NASA Astronaut:
Yeah, and to be honest, I think it's quite exciting to be here. Usually, as an astronaut, you get more and more calm. The closer you get to your launch, maybe people think it's the opposite. But actually, you know, your biggest worry as an astronaut is that something gets in the way between you in the lunch you bring your leg or technical problem. So the closer you get to lunch, even in last minutes, you know, this chance is getting smaller and smaller now, and I'm going to be on my way soon. So usually, we get calmer the closer we get to launch. There is, of course, our hardware on board from the European Space Agency. We want to make sure that we do our stuff, right. We're in the critical class to NASA strategy to go to the moon. So we want to really make sure that this works. So lots of stuff coming together. And to see this as an astronaut, where usually you're used to have some control right? You you controlling a vehicle you're controlling a spaceship that makes us calm to know that we can do that. Just standing there not being able to do anything. It makes us a bit nervous.
KANE FARABAUGH:
The Orion spacecraft is very automated, almost fully automated. Does somebody who's in it want more control of the spacecraft, or is the automation something that you welcome?
Alexander Gerst, NASA Astronaut:
Well, automation is not necessarily mean no control, right. So I think it's a good thing that we don't have to fly the spacecraft with two joysticks manually without any assistance, because that's actually difficult and dangerous. And I mean, it was one of the highest risk activities of the Apollo program. So having automation, for things that the computer can do better than the human actually really helps a lot. And it allows the human to take decisions that are more important like more high level decisions.
Nevertheless, there will always be in any kind of spacecraft, the necessity for a human to be able to take high level decisions and control what the spacecraft in general is doing right you want to be able to do a mission aboard you really need to know to know what to do when something goes wrong when the computer fails, right what is then what if you have an oxygen leak? What if you have a fire on board, things like that will always require human interaction. And so having a highly automated vehicle actually allows us to train more on the things that that are quite important for the mission success or even for, for to prevent the loss of life.
KANE FARABAUGH:
How tense is the wait to find out if or when or how you will have the opportunity to participate in the Artemis program?
Alexander Gerst, NASA Astronaut:
But also one thing that you have to get used to as an astronaut, which is hard for us because we're typically not the people who have a lot of patience is that you actually need to develop some sort of patience. Some colleagues of mine were called in the astronaut corps and then waited for 14 years before they flew. So really, you have to sometimes take a step back, take it easy and you know, just see how things come along.
Just the thought of me sitting on that rocket sometime. flying to the moon is a very exciting thought. But I know you know, it's nothing that I can can change other than being ready for it. My colleagues and I from the European astronaut corps, we're all qualified to do this. We have enough experience to do this. So it's not about you know who's the best or is he better or she better than me? It's a lot of decisions come in political decisions, which play a role when you have an agency with 22 member states. And so, you know, the easiest thing that I find and what my colleagues also probably see it that way, is that yeah, you take a step back and you let things come at you and you take them as they come.
KANE FARABAUGH:
This is broadening the cultural inclusion in this entire entire endeavor. And do you see that being from Europe? Do you see the excitement that it's generating?
Alexander Gerst, NASA Astronaut:
One of the most important parts of this mission is that it's internationally brought together and it's this huge international cooperation, which is good for many reasons, you know, first of all, you know, it's easier it's cheaper to do things when with your friends, right? You don't have to do everything on your own. International corporations tend to be more stable than things that one country does alone. Because, you know, people in that country could change their mind conditions could change and somebody says, “Oh, we'll cancel it.” It's harder to do when you have international partners, who were disappointed with that and who would fail the mission because you pulled out so in the end. It's often more stable. And we see that with the International Space Station. I very sure that one of the reasons why ISS was so successful is that it was such a big international cooperation, and nobody could really pull out and nobody did and now it works. And now because of that, we're harvesting all that scientific results that come down now, more than ever, right? Right now we're in the sort of the golden age of ISS where everything comes back, because we pulled it through up to this point, and I'm pretty sure the same thing will happen with the moon cooperation. I've seen many programs in my time that I've worked with ESA and NASA.
I've seen many programs being sort of brought up and then canceled again. Fortunately, for this one, I feel there's a different vibe when I go through the corridors of NASA people talk about this one differently. And I think that's part because of the international cooperation.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Is the general public invested enough in this effort in this endeavor? You know, can you get a sense of that, you know, are people generally well educated, well informed and interested in this?
Alexander Gerst, NASA Astronaut:
It was always, I think, our duty to make sure the public knows better and more about this project because it is fascinating. And in Europe, we of course, have the challenge that we need to integrate 22 Member States and, you know, tending to different parts of the culture, making sure that everybody understands how important it is to fly to space and we're bringing actually benefits back to Earth that are worth it that are worth investing that and then actually investing in space is something that pays back many, many for later. And that's that's something in Europe that we can easily calculate. So, for human spaceflight, a European isa citizen invest is much less than actually, citizens in America. Unfortunately, we only invest one euro 50 per person per year. But the payback is way, way bigger. Of course, you can calculate this where European space industry benefits a lot tremendously from those investments. And, of course, through that, through that capability, we have a seat at the table.
KANE FARABAUGH:
It's taken more than 50 years for people to go back to the moon. Do you think we will see people get to Mars in our lifetime?
Alexander Gerst, NASA Astronaut:
It would be important for us as humans to fly there, that's for sure. We have a lot of questions that Mars can answer us. For example, are we alone in the universe? Do we have sisters and brothers out there? Mars can potentially answer us that question in our lifetime. And I think that alone is a very, very exciting thought. But also it tells us about climate and how to protect the Earth. Mars was once a potentially habitable planet. it had liquid water, dense atmosphere. but now it's dead. It's a desert with not much more possibilities for life. What happened there and how can we prevent that the same happens to Earth?
KANE FARABAUGH:
Alexander Gerst. it's great to be able to have the chance to talk to you at Voice of America. Thanks for joining us here, we wish you the best and Godspeed to you and good luck.
Alexander Gerst, NASA Astronaut:
Same to you. Have a great launch!
KANE FARABAUGH:
Expanding the reach of NASA’s Artemis mission is a unique program the agency is spearheading that is partnering them with college students around the country, who are developing the next generation technology that will transform the way astronauts live and work on the surface of the moon, and also on Mars.
Northeastern University student Andre Neto Caetano watched NASA’s Artemis 1 launch from Kennedy Space Center in Florida live on a device in the lobby of a hotel across the country in California.
Andre Neto Caetano, Student, Northeastern University:
I had, not a flashback but a flash forward I guess of seeing maybe Artemis 4 or something and COBRA as part of the payload and it is on the moon doing what it was meant to do.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Artemis 1 launched the night before Caetano and his team presented their “Crater Observing Bio-inspired Rolling Articulator,” or COBRA, rover project in NASA’s 2022 “Breakthrough, Innovative, and Game Changing,” or BIG Idea Challenge.
The big challenge for Caetano’s team was impressing judges assembled in the remote California desert.
Andre Neto Caetano, Student, Northeastern University:
They were skeptical that the mobility solutions that we were proposing would actually work.
KANE FARABAUGH:
A skepticism born from the simplicity of their design.
Andre Neto Caetano, Student, Northeastern University:
It’s a robot that moves like a snake, and then the head and the tail connect, and then it rolls.
KANE FARABAUGH:
NASA’s BIG Idea Challenge, and the associated prize money, prompted teams of college students to develop solutions for the agency’s goals in the upcoming Artemis missions to the moon.
Andre Neto Caetano, Student, Northeastern University:
Extreme lunar terrain mobility.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Northeastern’s COBRA can uniquely move through fine desert sand, similar to the dust, or regolith, of the lunar surface, to probe the landscape for interesting features, including ice and water.
Alireza Ramezani, Assistant Professor, Northeastern University:
They never could sort of deploy a robot or a ground vehicle that can sort of negotiate the environment and get to the bottom of these craters and look for ice water content.”
KANE FARABAUGH:
Professor Alireza Ramezani advises Northeastern University’s team developing COBRA and is experienced in designing robots that mimic real organisms.
Andre Neto Caetano, Student, Northeastern University:
With like him building a robot dog and robot bat, we knew we wanted to have some bioinspiration in our project.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Ramezani hoped COBRA’s simple snake design could win over judges in NASA’s competition.
Alireza Ramezani, Assistant Professor, Northeastern University:
Our robot sort of tumbled 80-90 feet down this hill and that sort of impressed the judges. We did this with minimum energy consumption and within like 10 or 15 seconds.
KANE FARABAUGH:
COBRA is cost effective, too.
Alireza Ramezani, Assistant Professor, Northeastern University:
If you want to have a space worthy platform it’s going to be in the order of $100,000 to $200,000 dollars – you can have many of these systems tumbling down these craters.
Andre Neto Caetano, Student, Northeastern University:
The fact that COBRA is super light brings a benefit to it as well.
KANE FARABAUGH:
The Northeastern team’s November demonstration of COBRA in the California desert put to rest any lingering skepticism, sending them to the top of NASA’s 2022 BIG Idea competition — and hopefully in the not too distant future — to the top of NASA’s SLS rocket system on its way to the moon.
Alireza Ramezani, Assistant Professor, Northeastern University:
I’m not saying this, our judges said this, it’s potentially going to transform the way future space exploration systems look like.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Which is why, despite his impending graduation from Northeastern University later this year, Caetano plans to continue working on COBRA.
Andre Neto Caetano, Student, Northeastern University:
Because we brought it to life together, the idea of just fully abandoning it at graduation probably doesn’t appeal to most of us. // 19:49 “we still want to be involved in the project in making sure that what we started we are still the ones who put it on the moon at some point.
KANE FARABAUGH:
A point that could happen as soon as 2025, which is the year NASA hopes to return astronauts to the lunar surface in the Artemis program.
Thanks for joining us on this edition of The Inside Story, I’m Kane Farabaugh.
You can visit us on Instagram and Facebook on VOA News. You can also visit our website, voanews.com.
As NASA’s Artemis mission ushers in a new era of human spaceflight, we end the program by taking a look back, through the use of exclusive interviews Voice of America conducted over the years with those who were the first to chart the path forward to the moon… the original Apollo astronauts.
Harrison Schmitt, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 17:
In 1957. I was a Fullbright student in Norway, and I was out in the field gathering geological information. And the only American radio I could get was Voice of America out of Algiers, and it was during one of the Willis Conover broadcasts, Jazz from A to Z, that they interrupted and announced that the then Soviet Union had launched the first artificial satellite of the Earth, which was Sputnik One. And that’s when I realized I should start paying attention to space.
President John F. Kennedy:
,
We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard.
Jim Lovell, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 8, Apollo 13:
When President Kennedy made the announcement, we were planning to go to the moon, and get there before the end of the decade. I really couldn’t believe it, I said no, he’s just saying this thing to give us confidence, but I don’t think it’s possible.
President John F. Kennedy:
No nation which expects to be the leader of other nations can expect to stay behind in this race for space.
Eugene Cernan, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 10, Apollo 17:
Exceptionalism in space. Being number one. Being a leader. Anything less than that is unacceptable to the people of this nation.
Fred Haise, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 13:
It is a very dramatic expression of what can happen if you assemble the right people, the right skills, that work together as a team with the right leadership, what miracles can happen.
Michael Collins, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 11:
It was a wonderful example of organization within a large government agency.
Buzz Aldrin, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 11:
We invested a good bit of time, effort, and human endeavors to gain that leadership with the Apollo program.
NASA Audio:
Tranquility base here. The Eagle has landed.
Just stepping down from the LEM now.
That’s one small step for man. One giant leap for mankind.
Jim Lovell, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 8, Apollo 13:
The space program was a positive that gave people inspiration and hope about what this country was doing.
Houston we have a problem.
Gerry Griffin, NASA Flight Director, Apollo 13:
Apollo 13 is what a prepared team can do.
Buzz Aldrin, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 11:
The team that was trained to handle emergencies like that and like many other things did their job with great credit.
Gene Kranz, NASA Flight Director, Apollo Program:
I was the flight director for Apollo 17, when Gene Cernan and Jack Schmitt lifted off. We read a message up from the President that basically stated this might be the last time in this century. This was a bittersweet time for us because we were surrendering our drive as a nation to be explorers.
NASA Audio:
Leaving the planet Earth and going forward into the universe. I think no more significant contribution has Apollo made to history.
Eugene Cernan, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 10, Apollo 17:
We’ll go back to the moon.
Michael Collins, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 11:
My friend Neil Armstrong thought that going back to the moon was a proper and necessary precursor to a Mars expedition.
Harrison Schmitt, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 17:
To say that I thought it would be fifty or sixty years before Americans were back on the moon, I would not have guessed that at all.
Fred Haise, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 13:
It surprises me for the way that I felt at the time that we haven’t been to Mars.
Al Worden, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 15:
I think the space program that we’re getting into is going to require more and more cooperation with other countries.
Buzz Aldrin, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 11:
It can be and should be a very crucial reaffirmation time of the pathway that we chart.
Michael Collins, NASA Astronaut, Apollo 11:
I’m a Martian. I think Mars is the next great destination.
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