TRANSCRIPT:
The Inside Story: Evacuating Afghanistan (Episode 02 – August 26, 2021)
Voice of PATSY WIDAKUSWARA, VOA Senior White House Correspondent:
With a withdrawal deadline fast approaching, the U.S. steps up efforts to evacuate Americans and allies from Afghanistan.
We’re working hard and as fast as we can to get people out. That’s our mission. That’s our goal.
A look at the herculean mission to evacuate Afghanistan …
By air…
An exodus on land …
How it impacts the Afghans left behind …
And countries in the region.
The Inside Story: Evacuating Afghanistan, is next.
PATSY WIDAKUSWARA:
Hi. I’m at the White House where President Joe Biden is briefed daily on the Afghan evacuation. Images of chaotic scenes from the Kabul airport have dominated coverage since the fall of government - frantic Afghans trying to flee the country, fearful of life under the Taliban. The Biden administration says they have taken control of the chaos, but the urgency and danger remain. How the president handles America's final days in Afghanistan will be key to whether he can withstand his first major foreign policy crisis.
KATHERINE GYPSON, VOA Congressional Correspondent:
Evacuations at Kabul airport accelerating as the August 31st deadline for a complete U.S. withdrawal from Afghanistan draws near. The White House saying the U.S. is on track to meet that crucial deadline.
U.S. President Joe Biden:
Every day we're on the ground is another day we know that ISIS-K (Islamic State in Khorasan) is seeking to target the airport and attack both U.S. and allied forces and innocent civilians.
That announcement coming after the Taliban said they would not negotiate with the U.S. to extend the deadline.
Zabihullah Mujahid, Taliban Spokesman:
We convey again a message to the Americans to withdraw all their citizens in the given time frame. They have the facilities, airplanes are available, and they have control of the airport. They should evacuate all their forces and all their related contractors.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
The White House clarifying that evacuations will need to stop before August 31st.
Jen Psaki, White House Press Secretary:
There would need to be time to wind down the presence.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
The Pentagon saying it will need several days to remove U.S. personnel and equipment…the administration says there is still enough time to complete the mission of evacuating all Americans and eligible Afghans. In total, more than 70,000 individuals have already been evacuated — the largest such operation in U.S. history.
Maj. Gen. Hank Taylor:
This tremendous display of teamwork and focus resulted in a passenger count of 21,600 individuals leaving Afghanistan in just 24 hours.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
But U.S. lawmakers are already reviewing the reasons the Afghan government collapsed so quickly leading to that chaotic evacuation.
Rep. Adam Schiff, House Intelligence Committee Chairman
There were any number of warnings that the Taliban might take over and some that included a — the potential of a very rapid takeover. At the same time, though, I think it's also fair to say that no one predicted such a rapid collapse, a rapid and complete collapse of the Afghan government and forces.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
Capitol Hill Republicans say White House officials should resign for failing to predict the collapse and plan for an evacuation.
Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene, Republican:
This was Joe Biden’s fault, Kamala Harris' fault, and all of his administration and those in charge. Their plan to withdraw was completely irresponsible. They had the information, and they knew what they were going to do was going to create this crisis.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
Both Democrats and Republicans remain doubtful of the White House claim that the U.S. can complete the evacuation in time and have called on President Biden to extend it. The White House said Thursday it has contingency plans in case the evacuations need to continue into September. Katherine Gypson, VOA News, Washington.
CARLA BABB, VOA Pentagon Correspondent:
This is Carla Babb at the Pentagon. Evacuations from Kabul airport have ramped up, but tens of thousands of people still need to get out.
Gen. Steve Lyons, Commander of US Transportation Command:
We are pushing the limits to do everything we can to get every single evacuee out of Kabul.
Reports were confirmed by the Transportation Command chief today that three babies have been born amid the evacuation chaos, a testament to the humanity and the desperation of the evacuation. Inside Kabul, a precarious security situation. A firefight and a stampede outside the airport, both deadly. Taliban checkpoints still daunting and potential attacks from Islamic State looming.
Jake Sullivan, National Security Adviser:
Our commanders on the ground have taken every step they can to prepare for such an attack.
CARLA BABB:
Some of the 5,800 U.S. forces are now conducting sporadic rescue operations to help Americans get to the airport, with the August 31 deadline just days away – a date the Taliban have called a “red line.
CARLA BABB:
Are you going to ask for authorization of more troops?
Maj. Gen. Hank Taylor, Joint Staff Deputy Director for Regional Operations:
What I said is at 5,800 we’re able to continue to secure the airfield, continue to increase safety there, and continue to do the operations that we already have.
John Kirby, Pentagon Press Secretary
There are no plans at this time to request authorization of additional U.S. forces to this mission.
CARLA BABB:
Veteran’s groups and nongovernmental organizations are urging the president to get every American and at-risk Afghan out.
Matt Zeller, No One Left Behind:
Despite the fact that what the president is going out and saying to the global community, that what he's reporting simply isn't true. The vast majority of the people who want to get to the airport can't.
CARLA BABB:
The White House vowed Monday to continue evacuations for as long as it takes.
Jake Sullivan, National Security Adviser:
We will continue to get Afghans at risk out of the country even after U.S. military forces have left.
CARLA BABB:
But just how those Afghans will be rescued beyond an American troop pullout remains to be seen. CARLA BABB, VOA News, The Pentagon.
Voice of ESHA SARAI, VOA:
Landmark talks known as the intra Afghan peace process, are taking place between the Afghan government and the Taliban. Talks began September 2020. Both sides want a path to power sharing and a stop to what's described as Afghanistan's endless war.
The Taliban brutally ruled Afghanistan from 1996 to 2001 under strict Sharia, or Islamic law. The end came when the United States invaded in its search for Osama bin Laden, after the deadly 911 terrorist attacks on US soil.
Afghanistan formed a government led by Hamid Karzai, who promoted democracy and an open society. But the Taliban retains strongholds.
The Afghan government, with support from the US and NATO, has fought a protracted war.
The conflict has claimed some 157,000 lives, more than 43,000 of them civilians. The Taliban and Kabul set benchmarks for the peace talks.
Kabul wants a ceasefire, a power sharing agreement and rights in the Constitution to be upheld.
The Taliban want all foreign troops to leave, the release of around 5000 prisoners, and rights to be aligned with Islamic teachings.
The US, NATO, and others want a permanent ceasefire, the ability to deal with terrorism and a firm plan to ensure a peaceful future in Afghanistan.
Afghans are wary of a peace deal. Since talks began, a series of attacks of targeted journalists, members of civil society, and women. Media freedom and women's rights are protected in Afghanistan's 2004 constitution.
Since the fall of the Taliban, the country developed a thriving media scene with female journalists at the fore. The Taliban have denied involvement in the attacks, while insisting on Islamic law. The Afghan Government has not laid out specific conditions to protect to media freedom or women. That leaves many to question if freedoms gained over two decades of war will survive.
PATSY WIDAKUSWARA:
President Biden’s resolve to stick to his deadline of August 31 to end the U.S. military mission in Afghanistan has many concerned that it is not enough time go get everyone out who wants and needs to leave. More now from the President on his reasoning.
U.S. President Joe Biden[DF1] :
We are currently on a pace to finish by August the 31st. The sooner we can finish, the better. Each day of operations brings added risk to our troops. But the completion by August 31st depends upon the Taliban continuing to cooperate and allow access to the airport for those who were transport- -- we’re transporting out and no disruptions to our operations.
In addition, I’ve asked the Pentagon and the State Department for contingency plans to adjust the timetable should that become necessary. Every day we’re on the ground is another day we know that ISIS-K is seeking to target the airport and attack both U.S. and Allied forces and innocent civilians.
At the same time, we renewed our humanitarian commitment to the Afghan people and supported a proposal by the Secretary-General Guterres of the United Nations-led international response with unfettered humanitarian access in Afghanistan. Third, we talked about our mutual obligation to support refugees and evacuees currently fleeing Afghanistan. The United States will be a leader in these efforts and will look to the international community and to our partners to do the same. We're already seeing our Allies’ commitment. They're bringing their -- they're bringing to their countries the Afghans who served alongside their forces as translators or in their embassies, just as we're bringing to the United States those Afghans who worked alongside our forces and diplomats. We're continuing that effort.
We're conducting thorough security screening in the intermediate stops they're making for anyone who is not a U.S. citizen or a lawful permanent resident of the United States. Anyone arriving in the United States will have undergone a background check.And -- and we must all work together to resettle thousands of Afghans who ultimately qualify for refugee status. The United States will do our part. And we are already working closely with refugee organizations to rebuild a system that was purposefully destroyed by my predecessor.
PATSY WIDAKUSWARA:
As the numbers show, Afghanistan is almost three times the size of the UK, with close to 40 million people. And a very large number of refugees. Even before the Taliban takeover, two and a half million Afghans have fled the country, accounting for 10 percent of the world's refugees. Most of the Afghans now fleeing the Taliban make their journey by foot, including a group who have just arrived in eastern Turkey. They spoke to VOA’s Arif Aslan, who has this story narrated by Sirwan Kaijo:
Afghan refugees who have recently settled in Turkey say they fled their country for fear that a Taliban takeover would endanger their lives. Shakiba is among those who made it to the eastern Turkish city of Van over the weekend as the Taliban seized Kabul.
Shakiba, Afghan Refugee:
They scare us a lot. We couldn’t have sat like this. We would have to be fully covered. They take young girls to Pakistan, and I was afraid of that, so I came here. Why would I leave my home and suffer the difficult journey filled with hunger and thirst just to come here?
SIRWAN KAIJO:
For most of these refugees the journey is many days long, crossing from Afghanistan into Iran before arriving in Turkey. They say much of the journey is on foot under extreme weather conditions. But with the violence unfolding in Afghanistan, the refugees say life back home was becoming unbearable.
Hasibullah, Afghan Refugee:
One can’t live in Afghanistan anymore. How much can you tolerate there? That’s why all of us young people have left our country. You can't even make money to eat in Afghanistan. There is fighting during the day and night.
SIRWAN KAIJO:
To curb the influx of refugees, Turkey has begun building a concrete wall along its 295-kilometer-long border with Iran and increased its military presence in the area. Turkish officials said 156 kilometers of the wall have already been built. But for many Afghans, reaching safety in Turkey doesn’t mean an end to their hardships.
Hasibullah, Afghan Refugee:
Even coming here, we walk around afraid of being deported because we cannot just go and work somewhere legally. We will do any work available, whether it's sweeping or waiting tables or even working in farms because if we don't work then there is no life for us. We have to work here.
SIRWAN KAIJO:
Turkish authorities say there are 120,000 Afghan refugees in Turkey and up to 300,000 undocumented Afghan migrants. For Arif Aslan in Van, Turkey, this is Sirwan Kajjo, VOA News
PATSY WIDAKUSWARA:
Among the most desperate to get out of Afghanistan are tens of thousands of Afghans who worked for the United States in a variety of positions --- from menial to highly specialized. Getting them out before the Taliban took over involved a lengthy process. There is much more urgency now. VOA’s Carolyn Presutti profiles two former interpreters who fear for their lives.
CAROLYN PRESUTTI, VOA Correspondent:
Haji could be here. Or he could be here. Or here. He moves from city to city for safety from the Taliban. For 11 years he worked as an interpreter for US Special Forces, braving firefights across Afghanistan -- as he told VOA via Skype.
“Haji”, Former US Special Forces Interpreter:
Lugar Province and Kabul, Lot of these places, Nuristan, Kunar, Nangarhar Province.
CAROLYN PRESUTTI:
Haji, the name we use to protect his identity, has awards for his shrapnel wounds and for saving the lives of two army captains.
“Haji” Former US Special Forces Interpreter:
They saved me, I saved them because we are teammates.
CAROLYN PRESUTTI:
In 2010, the Taliban kidnapped Haji’s 9-year-old son because of his job and asked for ransom.
“Haji” Former US Special Forces Interpreter:
They know I am working with American forces and [they said,] ‘they are infidel and you are infidel because you are working with them and you are providing all kinds of help to them.’
CAROLYN PRESUTTI:
The Afghan police rescued his son a few weeks later in a gun battle with his kidnappers. He says they killed an older son a few months ago. Now Haji is trying to save his own life after cellphone threats from the Taliban.
“Haji” Former US Special Forces Interpreter:
They tell me they know my place; they know where I am staying, they are coming after me.
\
CAROLYN PRESUTTI:
Haji applied for a Special Immigrant Visa—an SIV--- more than three years ago. The embassy told him processing is delayed. President Biden said this about interpreters like Haji.
U.S. President Joe Biden:
There is a home for you in the United States if you so choose. We will stand with you, just as you stood with us.
Ismail Khan, Former US Interpreter:
The process is so complicated.
CAROLYN PRESUTTI:
Ismail Khan came to the United States on an SIV seven years ago. He was an interpreter alongside Haji whom he nicknamed “GPS” when he spoke with VOA on Skype.
Ismail Khan, Former US Interpreter:
He knew where to go, what route to take, what would be the easiest, where are possible places for them to ambush us - to make sure that they [we] are alert. He tried everything to make sure that his team would survive and be successful.
But Khan worries for his colleague.
Ismail Khan, Former US Interpreter:
They are after him, he is going to get killed if he doesn’t get out.
CAROLYN PRESUTTI:
Those who helped the Americans often protest in Afghanistan for safe passage out. Since January the Biden administration has approved 25-hundred special visas for Afghans who assisted the military and one thousand like Khan have settled in the U.S. But there are many still there, including an interpreter we will call James. James has been denied the special visa because he cannot provide paperwork proof of his employment.
“James” Former US Interpreter:
It’s really scary because brutal Taliban, they never forgive us.
CAROLYN PRESUTTI:
James told VOA that fears for his safety – and that of his family --- keep him awake at night. And, like Haji, he worries what will happen, after the complete withdrawal of U.S. troops on August 31. Carolyn Presutti, VOA News.
PATSY WIDAKUSWARA:
While the U.S. and NATO allies hope to have some lasting influence in Afghanistan, their withdrawal leaves a vacuum that its neighbors are willing to fill. Among them, China, which shares an 80-kilometer border with Afghanistan. VOA’s Elizabeth Lee explains the risks and benefits for both countries.
ELIZABETH LEE, VOA Correspondent:
Long before the balance of power in Afghanistan changed swiftly, China had been paving the road for a relationship with the Taliban. On July 28, China’s foreign minister met with high-level Taliban officials in the Chinese city of Tianjin.
Raffaello Pantucci, S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies:
But actually in the week before that, President Xi had actually called and spoken to President (Ashraf) Ghani and impressed his continued support for the Afghan government. So China essentially has been hedging.
Some Central Asia analysts believe China was a factor in the speed of the Taliban takeover of Afghanistan.
Seth Jones, Center for Strategic and International Studies:
The Afghan security forces recognized that the Taliban had the support of China, had the support of Russia, Pakistan and Iran, most of the major countries in the region, probably with the exception of India. So, morale was devastated.
ELIZABETH LEE:
Some analysts say China’s interests in Afghanistan include its mineral deposits and location relative to China’s Belt and Road Initiative, which aims to expand China’s political and economic influence to Europe through investment and infrastructure projects. While the vacuum left by the U.S. in Afghanistan could be an opportunity for China, analysts expect Beijing to be cautious.
Andrew Small, The German Marshall Fund of the United States:
China still sees Afghanistan through this sort of obsessive graveyard of empires prism. They don't want to get sucked in. They think it's a risk. They think it's a trap.
ELIZABETH LEE:
China’s biggest concern is security.
Andrew Small, The German Marshall Fund of the United States:
First of all, ensuring that there isn't a spillover of some of the security threats in Afghanistan to the wider neighborhood where China has much more substantial economic, political and strategic interests and certainly the case for Central Asia, and particularly, I think, in the case of Pakistan.
ELIZABETH LEE:
With Chinese investments and transportation routes through Pakistan, the two countries share a need for stability.
Mushahid Hussain Syed, Pakistan Senator:
First, that Afghan soil should not be used against China, It shares a 50-miles-long border with Afghanistan.
ELIZABETH LEE:
Politically, China has used the situation in Afghanistan to criticize the U.S.
Hua Chunying, Chinese Foreign Ministry:
We've seen the U.S. military leave an awful mess of unrest, division, families ruined and orphaned.
ELIZABETH LEE:
While Afghanistan may be a public relations win for China, analysts say the reality is different.
Raffaello Pantucci, S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies:
I think concerns about Afghanistan becoming a place where Uyghur militants or dissidents can sort of plot and foment trouble within China is one of China’s preeminent concerns.
ELIZABETH LEE:
While China sees the Uyghur Muslims as a threat and a part of its war of terror, Human rights groups have raised alarms over China’s persecution and treatment of Uyghur Muslims. Analysts say it would be costly for the Taliban to take up the Uyghur cause. The Taliban may not sympathize with the Uyghurs for another reason: religion.
Hasan Karrar, Lahore University of Management Sciences:
In both places, the role of Islam, how Islam is understood, is very, very different.
ELIZABETH LEE:
Analysts agree China will take on a watch-and-wait stance as the situation in
Afghanistan unfolds. Elizabeth Lee VOA News, Washington.
PATSY WIDAKUSWARA:
800-thousand U.S. troops served in Afghanistan during the nearly 20 years of U.S. military involvement. VOA’s Kane Farabaugh was a reporter for the U.S. military in the early years of the war and documented the stories of many service members. He reached out to them again out to find out how they view the way America’s longest war is ending … and their service in it.
KANE FARABAUGH, VOA Correspondent:
As he watches circumstances in Afghanistan unfold on the TV at his home in Missouri, veteran Steve Hutcherson is in shock.
Steve Hutcherson, U.S. Air National Guard Veteran
It’s difficult to watch. You’ve seen the videos of the fall of Saigon and everything, and it’s kind of eerily similar. We’ve spent so much in human lives and national treasure to maintain what we have, and you see it all gone in a flash.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Afghanistan’s return to Taliban control is a personal setback for Hutcherson. He was among the first wave of uniformed U.S. military forces sent to the country in early 2002, working as an air traffic controller at Bagram Airfield, coordinating allied aircraft in combat and support missions aimed at eliminating terrorists. He believes the U.S. met its objective.
Steve Hutcherson, U.S. Air National Guard Veteran:
The result was that we’ve been safe for the last 20 years.
KANE FARABAUGH:
But he also thinks the U.S. effort to build a democratic Afghan nation was an “unwinnable war.”
Steve Hutcherson, U.S. Air National Guard Veteran:
You are trying to fight an idea. You don’t fight an idea, you know, with weapons and stuff.
Rhonda Lawson, U.S. Army Veteran:
I guess the shocking part to me is how quickly everything happened.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Rhonda Lawson watched the rapid fall of the Afghan government from her home in Maryland. Nearly 20 years ago, her home had been Bagram Airfield, serving as a noncommissioned officer for a U.S. Army mobile public affairs detachment. In Afghanistan, she witnessed U.S. efforts to train a new Afghan National Army.
Rhonda Lawson, U.S. Army Veteran:
It does kind of change my view as to whether the Afghan National Army was prepared to defend their own country, and I don’t know if it was a case of them not fighting or them failing, but for the Taliban to have taken over as quickly as they did, as I said, it was quite shocking.
Steve Hutcherson, U.S. Air National Guard Veteran:
We’ve spent an incredible amount of money to train their army to fight for themselves, and it doesn’t seem like they want to. For whatever reason I don’t know. If they don’t want to fight for themselves, we can’t stay there forever.
Dan Millbauer, U.S. Army Veteran:
After 20 years, I don’t think we need to have U.S. military forces on the ground there.
KANE FARABAUGH:
Dan Millbauer served in different U.S. Army units during two deployments to Afghanistan, which allowed him to travel extensively in the country while there.
Dan Millbauer, U.S. Army Veteran:
A place like Afghanistan has historically been problematic. The Soviets tried. We tried for 20 years now to make things the way they should be, // but if the Taliban rises to power again, there is a reason for that, and we’ll respond as we feel appropriate in the future.
KANE FARABAUGH:
With the Taliban now seemingly in control of Afghanistan’s uncertain future, the exodus of those seeking safety elsewhere, and still have the means to flee, continues. Kane Farabaugh, VOA News, Chicago.
PATSY WIDAKUSWARA:
Keep up on the evacuation efforts and latest developments in Afghanistan at VOANews.Com. Stay connected @VOANews on Instagram and Facebook. Follow me on Twitter at P-Widakuswara. I am Patsy Widakuswara. See you next week for The Inside Story.
