Transcript:
The Inside Story: Israel at War
Episode 113 – October 12, 2023
Show Open:
Unidentified Narrator:
This week on The Inside Story, Israel suffers a deadly large scale coordinated attack at the hands of the terrorist group Hamas.
Militants turned kidnappers holding hostages as collateral while allies say they stand with Israel.
What's happened so far? And what's next in the conflict?
Now, on The Inside Story, Israel at War.
The Inside Story:
ANITA POWELL, VOA White House Correspondent:
Welcome to The Inside Story. I am Anita Powell, White House Correspondent for VOA. Last Saturday, Hamas militants crossed into southern Israel, attacking both civilians and soldiers and killing more than 1-thousand people, and kidnapping at least 100 Israeli civilians, including children. Israel’s response, a massive airborne barrage into Gaza, has been swift and significant and Palestinian authorities report the death toll in Gaza has surpassed a thousand people, with over five thousand wounded. Israeli says this is just the beginning of their military response.
International reaction has been overwhelming in its condemnation of the attacks. President Joe Biden said, "This was an act of sheer evil" and pledged to support Israel. In the wake of the attack, Iran’s support for the Palestinian group Hamas is in the spotlight. VOA’s Henry Ridgwell reports.
HENRY RIDGWELL, VOA Correspondent:
The Hamas attack on Israel Saturday took most regional powers by surprise, but many analysts say Iran would have approved the assault in advance.
Lina Khatib, Director, Middle East Institute at SOAS University of London:
Iran has been for several years supporting Hamas through funding and through training and through military equipment. Decisions to engage in war by these groups like Hezbollah, Hamas, the Islamic Jihad and others can only happen with explicit prior direct agreement from Iran. But this is very different from saying that Iran ordered these groups to do these attacks.
HENRY RIDGWELL:
Iran has described Hamas’s actions as ‘the manifestation of resistance’ – but denied any responsibility.
Israel’s president, Isaac Herzog, blamed “an evil axis whose base is in Iran.” Israeli officials say there is no direct evidence that Tehran directed the attack.
Khaled Elgindy, Middle East Institute, Washington:
This is an operation that was launched by a Palestinian group for its own Palestinian reasons. Hamas is not an operative or a proxy of the Iranian regime. Although there may be convergences of interests.
HENRY RIDGWELL:
What interest would Iran have in renewed conflict between Hamas and Israel? Geopolitical alliances are shifting fast. Saudi Arabia and Israel are attempting to normalize diplomatic relations, supported by the United States.
The Palestinian Authority – a domestic rival to Hamas – is taking part in the talks.
Lina Khatib, Director, Middle East Institute at SOAS University of London:
The deal involves Saudi Arabia talking to the Palestinian Authority. Hamas was not part of this discussion and therefore Hamas felt first of all that it needed to be part of any solution to the Palestine-Israel conflict. And so, we're talking about a geopolitical context in which Hamas - and also its backer, Iran - want to set the political agenda.
HENRY RIDGWELL:
Meanwhile, Tehran’s negotiations with the West over a return to the 2015 Iran nuclear deal – and a lifting of sanctions - have stalled.
Khalil Jahshan, Executive Director, Arab Center Washington DC:
Troublemaking is negotiating by other means. And I believe that this is applicable to this situation. I'm not sure Iran is seeking a larger confrontation. As I said, it's probably seeking attention and seeking basically, to convince the big powers involved in the region, particularly the United States, to take the Iranian role in the region seriously.
HENRY RIDGWELL:
Washington should reassess its Iran policy, argues Khatib.
Lina Khatib, Director, Middle East Institute at SOAS University of London:
U.S. foreign policy has focused on Iran's nuclear file and has in a way pushed Iran's regional role to the margins. I think there is now no denying that Iran's regional role needs to be central to U.S. policy.
HENRY RIDGWELL:
U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken said Sunday he had not yet seen direct evidence of Iranian involvement in the Hamas attack.
Meanwhile, Israel’s prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, said Monday his country’s response would "change the Middle East." He did not elaborate on what this meant.
Henry Ridgwell, VOA News, London.
ANITA POWELL:
Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu compares Hamas to ISIS in a call for international unity against the organization. His counterpart, US President Joe Biden, echoes that description and outlines America’s support to its staunch Middle East ally. Repeating live on air, “We stand with Israel. We stand with Israel.”
President Joe Biden minced no words in describing the shock and horror of Hamas’ surprise weekend attack on Israel.
President Joe Biden:
This was an act of sheer evil. More than 1,000 civilians slaughtered — not just killed, slaughtered — in Israel. Among them, at least 14 American citizens killed. Parents butchered using their bodies to try to protect their children. Stomach-churning reports of babies being killed. Entire families slain.
And he clarified Washington’s stance on Israel’s counteroffensive.
President Joe Biden:
We stand with Israel. And we will make sure Israel has what it needs to take care of its citizens, defend itself and respond to this attack. There's no justification for terrorism. There's no excuse.
ANITA POWELL:
To that end, he said, the U.S. has sent a strike carrier group to the region, and he says he’ll ask Congress — once a new House speaker is elected — to “take urgent action to fund the national security requirements of our critical partners.
Analysts say the carnage has touched a raw nerve at the White House, which illuminated itself in Israel’s colors over the tragedy.
Daniel Byman, Center for Strategic and International Studies:
There may be Americans captured by a terrorist group. And that's got to be a priority of any American president. And the second issue is coming to terms with the deaths of Americans in a terrorist attack in Israel. Add to that all the complexities of a very difficult regional situation, and it involves not only Israel and Hamas, but the possibility of Hezbollah and Iranian involvement. So President Biden is trying to wrestle with all these.
ANITA POWELL:
VOA asked the White House whether Biden asked Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to exercise restraint in his military response.
John Kirby, National Security Council:
Nobody wants to see innocent life taken. And as I said, there's been too much of it. One of the great things about our relationship with Israel is that we're two vibrant democracies and we mutually believe in things like the respect for innocent life and the rule of law. And we're always stronger together, our two countries, when we show that to the world, that we do respect innocent life and that we do respect not only the rule of law but the law of war.
ANITA POWELL:
U.S. adversaries were quick to point blame.
Vladimir Putin, Russian President:
Unfortunately, we can see a sharp deterioration of the situation in the Middle East. I think that many will agree with me that this is a clear example of the failure of the policy of the United States in the Middle East, which tried to monopolize the resolution [of the conflict], but, unfortunately, was not concerned with finding compromises acceptable to both sides.
ANITA POWELL:
Kirby said conflict in Israel won’t take Washington’s eye off other threats, wherever they are.
John Kirby, National Security Council:
Any nation who might think that somehow the United States is going to get distracted should think again. We are a large enough, big enough, powerful enough country, economically viable enough — in fact, the economy's incredibly strong right now — that we can look after our national security interests and those of our allies and partners anywhere around the world.
ANITA POWELL:
Nor, Biden said, will he walk away from Israel.
On the heels of President Biden promising US support to Israel, Secretary of State Antony Blinken plans to visit the region in a show of support for Israel’s right to self-defense. Meanwhile, analysts say the Hamas attacks further complicate US diplomacy with respect to Saudi-Israeli normalization.
As VOA State Department Bureau Chief Nike Ching reports, the US continues coordinating with regional allies to deter any country that may take advantage of the situation.
NIKE CHING, VOA State Department Bureau Chief:
Israel has declared control over the Gaza border while continuing its airstrikes on Hamas infrastructure in Gaza. This comes in the aftermath of unprecedented attacks by the Palestinian militant group and despite their threats to execute hostages.
In Washington, U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken is heading to Israel to show solidarity. The top diplomat has spoken to foreign ministers from the region, as one of the diplomatic priorities is to prevent violence from spreading to other parts of the Middle East.
Matthew Miller, State Department Spokesperson:
Secretary Blinken will be traveling to Israel in the coming days to engage our Israeli partners directly about the situation on the ground, and how we can continue to best support them in the fight against the terrorists who launched these horrific attacks. Our support for Israel is unwavering.
NIKE CHING:
U.S. officials have pledged American support in efforts to free hostages taken during the Hamas assault. U.S. citizens are among the captives.
Matthew Miller, State Department Spokesperson:
There are a number of countries that have the ability to deliver messages to Hamas, and we have made clear to those countries they should urge Hamas to release all hostages immediately.
NIKE CHING:
While Israel indicated it does not want any pause in efforts to reach a normalization deal with Saudi Arabia, the recent Hamas attacks have complicated the diplomatic efforts for such a deal, according to analysts.
Seth Jones, Center for Strategic and International Studies:
The current outbreak of war will likely set that back, including timelines back. It doesn't necessarily mean that normalization of ties will be over, but I think for now, the focus is going to be on various aspects of the war itself and aid to the Israelis.
NIKE CHING
The United States has said the pursuit of a diplomatic deal between Israel and Saudi Arabia could not replace a two-state solution to address the needs of the Palestinian people, and Hamas does not represent their legitimate aspirations for an independent State of Palestine.
Nike Ching, VOA News, Washington.
ANITA POWELL:
The reaction from Capitol Hill to the war in Israel has been strong and clear regarding the U.S. support for Israel's right to defend itself. Our VOA Persian Service spoke with the Chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, who placed blame on Iran for the attacks and discussed the actions taken by the U.S. to assist Israel.
Rep. Michael McCaul, Chairman House Foreign Affairs Committee:
They they've killed almost 1000 Israelis. I've seen, you know, video images of little toddlers in cages like animals and the indiscriminate killing. And it's been in the works for probably over a year. Iran is behind this. Iran funds it. Iran gives the weapons.
My message to Iran is stay out of this and to Hezbolla, stay out of this. the United States is going to protect and defend Israel. We've already sent a battleship to the region and this is not the way to carry out. You have diplomacy discussions. Fine. But killing innocent civilians is not the way to go about those.
ANITA POWELL:
Hamas militants also kidnapped scores of people from various backgrounds and nationalities in their attack.
Taking them back to Gaza and making a promise ahead of escalating Israeli counterstrikes.
For every residential target with women and children hit by Israel, Hamas says it will broadcast the execution of a hostage.
VOA has a look at the swelling anger along the Gaza Strip.
Unidentified Narrator:
Israelis living in the areas surrounding the Gaza Strip have been evacuated, and rockets continue to shoot out of the enclave.
The more than two million Palestinian people inside are trapped, as it is pummeled by heavy weaponry night and day.
Among the civilians in Gaza are as many as 150 Israeli hostages.
Family members are terrified that their loved ones will not be rescued.
Stolarz Adolpho, Presumes Niece Has Been Kidnapped:
I don’t know how this is going to end, but it won’t be a happy end. For nobody. It’s not a happy end.
Unidentified Narrator:
Humanitarian groups inside Gaza say the crisis is deepening for civilians, already cut off from the world, and now cut off from outside resources, like electricity, water and food.
In Jerusalem, about an hour and a half from Gaza and still close enough to sometimes take rocket fire, many Israelis are enraged by the conflict, saying despite their government’s famed security prowess, it failed to protect them.
Others in this market blame the Palestinian people as a whole, saying the two sides of this conflict have never been more at odds.
Nir Barashi, Israeli Citizen:
I say it again: Or us, or them. We can start to hit them. Hit them strong.
Unidentified Narrator:
Hamas, the militant group that launched the surprise attack on Saturday, rules in Gaza. Hundreds of civilians on both sides have been killed, and thousands have been injured.
Outside the Gaza Strip, debris from the first days of this new conflict remains on the abandoned streets, as Israel mounts its forces for what may soon be even more of an escalation.
VOA News reporting from Jerusalem, Kfar Daniel and southern Israel.
ANITA POWELL:
The current conflict is complex and confusing and defies comprehension.
To help us understand what happened and why and what may come next we reached out to a few Mideast experts for their reaction.
Here’s what they told us.
Rich Outzen, Atlantic Council: (he goes by Rich – not Richard)
I don't think based on what happened and the severity of the losses for Israel, that Israel can afford to leave Hamas in control of the Gaza Strip. So that means an extended campaign to remove their ability to govern the Gaza Strip
I think that Israel will not again see Hamas as a necessary evil or a partner that it can deal with in in Gaza. I think that game is over.
Barbara Slavin, Stimson Center:
I would be surprised if Iranian officials despite their denials, were not aware of what Hamas was planning. I think there's also tremendous concern that we may see other groups that have been supported by Iran on seeking us Palestinian Islamic Jihad in the West Bank has Ebola in the north get involved in this conflict, especially as Israel pound's Gaza.
Khaled Elgindy, Middle East Institute:
it's obviously an intelligence failure. But I think it's also a political failure on the part of this far right Israeli government. They have touted themselves as the government that will bring Israel security once and for all.
And so what Hamas has done is to shatter that sense of complacency. I think, irrevocably.
ANITA POWELL:
Long-time Middle East correspondent Linda Gradstein has covered Israel for more than 30 years. She says the current situation—a war on the home front—is unlike anything she has reported on before. Here she is, in Jerusalem, in her own words.
LINDA GRADSTEIN, VOA Correspondent:
I'm based in Jerusalem for Voice of America. I'm standing here on my balcony in Jerusalem. Jerusalem has actually been relatively quiet. We've had a few rockets, we've had to go into our bomb shelter every apartment in Israel is built with a bomb shelter.
I have to say that I've been reporting on this conflict for almost four years and I've never seen anything like this. You know Israel's a very small country and everybody knows somebody who has been affected by this war. So I think there's a feeling in the streets of Jerusalem people are scared and people are also angry. They're very angry at Hamas, you know.
Earlier an interviewer asked me if Israelis are concerned about what's going on in Gaza and I said not at all. I think the fact that there's a sense that Israelis want this to end, but they want to see it through at the same time as a journalist. You know, the homefront is here.
There's been a lot of propaganda on both sides. And now people are sort of trying to understand and trying to be a little bit more careful about what they report. I'm trying very hard, not only to report things that I know are true, and to verify things before I report them. And I think that's really the obligation of every journalist.
I think the Israeli government has been very good about trying to reach out to journalists, I get sort of minute by minute updates from the Israeli army spokesman with videos and all kinds of things. So I think it's been a challenge to report on this war. I think we're finally understanding how do we go about it.
I think we're trying to be very careful about what we do. And sometimes it's hard. I mean, I have been working basically around the clock for five days and none of us have slept very much. And every once in a while I do find myself crying. I think about these young people. One of the people who's a hostage and Gaza is the son of friends of mine. He's 23 years old. They've been very open about trying to get the international community on board to try to get him out of Gaza that hits close to home.
And I personally think that it's okay to bring who you are as a journalist to your reporting, but you still have to verify everything. I also think of the Palestinian civilians in Gaza and in my reporting, I've been really trying to, you know, make contacts with people in Gaza. I have a friend who said that she and her mother in Gaza, evacuated to a school, a United Nations run school because they have nowhere to go.
So, I think that it's a challenge to do this kind of reporting. I still feel like it's a privilege to this kind of reporting.
ANITA POWELL:
Journalists covering wars in this digital age regularly find themselves reporting on two fronts: the physical battle and the barrage of disinformation and propaganda shared online. This conflict is no different. From Washington, VOA’s Robin Guess has the story.
ROBIN GUESS, VOA Correspondent:
Bombings and airstrikes blast targets across Israel and Gaza following Hamas's deadly terror attack on Israel Saturday and Israel’s counteroffensive.
At the same time, disinformation about the conflict exploded online with a force that has shocked analysts.
Alex Mahadevan, MediaWise Director:
It is worse than the lead-up or following Jan 6. It’s worse than the height of the COVID-19 pandemic or vaccination rollouts. This is, quite frankly, the most intense amount of misinformation that I’ve seen spread on social media as far back as I can remember.
ROBIN GUESS:
Among the posts going viral on platforms like TikTok and X — that groups like MediaWise are working to debunk — is this fake video clip.
It claims that Ukraine smuggles weapons to Hamas, and it has racked up close to a million views. But the post — and video — are false.
Another shows children in cages and claims that they are Israelis kidnapped by Hamas. But watchdogs found that the video was posted on TikTok days before Saturday's attack.
And in this last example, both the post and the reporter are fake. The BBC has neither a correspondent by the name of Verona Mark, nor a talk show called American Inside. X later suspended the account for violating platform rules.
In an active conflict zone, journalists can’t always access the hardest-hit areas, which creates information voids. And disinformation often fills that vacuum.
Sherif Mansour, Committee to Protect Journalists:
It means that a lot of misinformation, propaganda online can undermine efforts of timely accurate information that the public needs and also millions around the world.
ROBIN GUESS:
Social media can help journalists broadcast the truth, but it can also allow false news to flourish. Some media experts have pointed out changes at X, formerly Twitter, including its staffing cuts, that have resulted in the spread of disinformation.
Alex Mahadevan, MediaWise:
I think by habit a lot of journalists like myself and regular people flocked to X — formerly Twitter — to find out what was happening with the Israel-Hamas war. Now unfortunately the new X, the entire trust and safety team has been gutted, so you are not seeing the same amount of staffing that we are involved with pulling down dis- and misinformation and moderating even violent content and hateful conduct.
ROBIN GUESS:
The European Union on Tuesday reminded X owner Elon Musk and social media platforms of their legal requirement to not share such content. Musk replied via X, saying his platform was transparent, and he called on the EU to list the alleged violations.
Meanwhile, amid such abundant disinformation about the conflict, journalists must sort fact from fiction to ensure audiences have access to credible news.
Robin Guess, VOA News:
ANITA POWELL:
For more on this rapidly developing situation stay informed by visiting voanews.com.
That’s all for now. Follow us on Instagram and Facebook at voa news. Follow me on twitter at @6armspowell. Catch up on past episodes with our free streaming service, voa plus. I’m Anita Powell at the white house. We leave you of images of support for Israel from around the world.
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